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Re: Halo on E bay

PostPosted: Wed Mar 13, 2013 1:07 am
by phoenix
Udu?Idu too wrote:I have to agree with lino. Whilst a 'tuning embargo' might dissuade those 'in the know', it's not safe to assume that all potential buyers are as savvy. I don't presume to speak for Kyle, but based on personal experience of him I doubt he'd refuse a retune out of love for the instrument as much as unwillingness to punish the buyer unecessarily (sp).


Agreed

This guy is an asshole and karma will bite him there one day ... I'd love to be able to say I would not like to be there to see it but I would be lying. I am simply not that 'enlightened' ... my bad
It really pains me to see PS's goodwill being abused in this manner and I applaud their ability to see past it and keep innovating without penalising the rest of us. It must hurt every time this happens, and to stand tall in the face of it is commendable. I know I would not be able to ... I guess that is something to aspire to

Nice thoughts Roy, but with someone like this, they are only ever going to learn the hard way, if at all

Re: Halo on E bay

PostPosted: Wed Mar 13, 2013 1:18 am
by SteelQuest
That was my bad, I did not clarify the points that I do agree with lino on, and that is that I also believe that Kyle would not refuse a retuning out of the love of his work in the hands of the "victim" (or maybe anyone at that). I just think there should be a way to make sure the victimization is kept to a minimum, especially at the expense of the makers and those patiently in wait.

At the end of the day as said before I was simply trying to think of solutions to try to limit people taking advantage of people that although I haven't yet met; have a deep respect love and admiration for. They have created something so beautiful it is hard to see it marred with disingenuousness. I would have no problem signing something that agreed not to profiteer off of them.

That being said I am not sure if there is a way to balance out the market price of these instruments, however there is really no way to balance out the price of the art market either... And similarly you pay more for a Stradivarius than you do a Yamaha. What is fair what is right what is just?

I so wanted to put "Whatever it takes" on my lottery entry but then changed to wanting to put "Whatever Kyle and Jim think is fair", because I believe they are the ones who have worked so hard to bring these masterpieces to us and whatever they feel is the right price is just fine with me. I do not have a ton of money, but I found a way to make the funds available and that meant sacrifice. For some out there they have lots, and perhaps should thusly pay more, for those without the means, there are alternatives...

Again I want to say I do not purpose to have all the answers or perhaps any of them.

Its awful hard to come from <3 sometimes. But in the end that is the only way....sigh

Re: Halo on E bay

PostPosted: Wed Mar 13, 2013 1:52 am
by phoenix
SteelQuest wrote:That was my bad, I did not clarify the points that I do agree with lino on, and that is that I also believe that Kyle would not refuse a retuning out of the love of his work in the hands of the "victim" (or maybe anyone at that). I just think there should be a way to make sure the victimization is kept to a minimum, especially at the expense of the makers and those patiently in wait.

At the end of the day as said before I was simply trying to think of solutions to try to limit people taking advantage of people that although I haven't yet met; have a deep respect love and admiration for. They have created something so beautiful it is hard to see it marred with disingenuousness. I would have no problem signing something that agreed not to profiteer off of them.



No bad ... you came from the <3

I, like many, would have no problem signing something reasonable ... I think the major problem with this is the enforcement across borders and the cost involved even within borders. At the end of the day, as I understand it, even the PANArt 'contracts' are essentially 'goodwill' and unenforceable. They rely on the ethics of the buyers. And then there is the huge question of 'Can you and should you try to put terms and conditions upon the purchase of an item after it is sold'. As I understand it, PS don't want to go there, hence the acrobatics involved in the latest 'lottery'.

Personally I think a 1-2 year buy-back option should be totally acceptable to any genuine buyer, with no 'ifs' or 'buts'. But is it practical or enforceable ? And what lines does it cross ?

I wish to swap a Halo of mine for a different scale, and was faced a choice in the lottery - I could obviously have bid very high knowing I could Ebay it to cover the cost and some. But once its 'up there' its never coming down. So I bid a relatively good price based on the info we were given in the hope that I get lucky and can pass this one on at a lower price and switch to a preferred scale for a cost differential that I can afford. So I gave up the 'high bid' option and have left it to fate.
I would rather 'lose' that way than 'win' the other ... but that's just me talking and we all have our own opinions.

<3

Re: Halo on E bay

PostPosted: Wed Mar 13, 2013 2:01 am
by Michael1213
Bidding over 6 grand. He's making some serious cash. He hit the lottery twice.

Re: Halo on E bay

PostPosted: Wed Mar 13, 2013 2:39 am
by Hobo Perdido
well fellas, there is no productive outcome on hating this guy.......

he did what ever he felt like doing....... in my head is difficult not to feel frustrated, i mean.... a brand new golden gate..... wow.....
but after a couple of days i just don´t think about it anymore..... i know that most of us want a handpan to play them to connect among us, travel around the world and connect with others who perhaps have never seen one in their life....

i really don´t want to know how much money this guy will make..... is a bit sad but hey..... that´s life, sometimes is happy and some other times.... well.... is not....

blessings for all

Re: Halo on E bay

PostPosted: Wed Mar 13, 2013 2:43 am
by phoenix
Hobo Perdido wrote:well fellas, there is no productive outcome on hating this guy.......


Agreed ... life will square that one up eventually ;)
I don't hate him ... I just think he is an asshole ...

Re: Halo on E bay

PostPosted: Wed Mar 13, 2013 2:47 am
by thejerrymobile
... And hopefully someone will buy it and actually appreciate it, regardless of the (regrettable) nature of its sale. And maybe we'll see them around here someday. It's unfortunate that some people profiteer like this, but at the very least the Halo won't go unloved. Hopefully.

It's just good to know that most people who win the Halo lottery have the integrity not to flip them directly to the free market.

Re: Halo on E bay

PostPosted: Wed Mar 13, 2013 2:51 am
by phoenix
thejerrymobile wrote:It's just good to know that most people who win the Halo lottery have the integrity not to flip them directly to the free market.


You can't put a price on integrity, and relationships are worth far more than money ;)

Re: Halo on E bay

PostPosted: Wed Mar 13, 2013 3:27 am
by Miguel Carvalho
phoenix wrote:You can't put a price on integrity, and relationships are worth far more than money ;)

:bow:

Re: Halo on E bay

PostPosted: Wed Mar 13, 2013 6:07 am
by AoxoA
phoenix wrote:
thejerrymobile wrote:It's just good to know that most people who win the Halo lottery have the integrity not to flip them directly to the free market.


You can't put a price on integrity, and relationships are worth far more than money ;)


This is true. There are always a few bad rotten apples like Robert Sobota from michigan. Try not to let them ruin your day.