Halo on E bay (Warning: Flipping for Profit)

[drumabob]

Michael, this is the thread about Roberto Sobota's Golden Gate on eBay... This is getting confused.

ok ..in that case lets make it clear ban all flippers

[thejerrymobile]

Just got a notification from eBay about this listing. Some people just have no respect...

[Miguel Carvalho]

Michael, this is the thread about Roberto Sobota's Golden Gate on eBay... This is getting confused.

[omrhythm]

Just got a notification from eBay about this listing. Some people just have no respect...

What was the notification about?

[phoenix]

This is the response we received (reproduce in full) from Robert Sobota, the seller:

EDIT :

After the announcement of the Batch Two lottery and my subsequent entry, on 3/9/2011 I won one of the 200 spots. After a brief email exchange with Aaron at Pantheon, I agreed to be one of the last recipients for the batch because of personal finances. He anticipated that the tail end of the batch would be at the end of 2011 or early 2012.

To my surprise, though, and despite seeing Pantheon selling new Halos on ebay during this period of time, 2011 AND 2012 came and went. However, I did not complain, because I figured that 1) they must have needed supplementary funds to continue production, or 2) they knew they were undercharging for their product, so the ebay route would net them fair market value. If either one of these reasons were true, though, I don't blame them a bit.

Robert

Nice attempt to turn it around and blame PS ...

Roughly translated, Aaron as usual bent over backwards to help somebody who needed to arrange the finance for their Halo by agreeing to move him down the line. Clearly THEY did not ask HIM to go to the end of the Batch - he requested it or something similar and PS obliged. And it took longer than either party expected ...

And now it's all their fault and fully justifies your actions ... nice try Robert, but you are full of sh*t

Reality ... somebody helped you when you asked them to and you turned round and kicked them in the teeth afterwards as a thankyou ... nice guy ...
PS's business model may not be perfect (you slipped though the net), but your personality is certainly flawed

[thejerrymobile]

Just got a notification from eBay about this listing. Some people just have no respect...

What was the notification about?

I have a saved search on eBay that notifies me whenever "Pantheon + Halo" shows up, mainly for the PS eBay auctions, but it also alerts me whenever someone else sells a Halo, too, so I usually see a notification and come here to find out it's a flipper :\

[lino]

I doubt Kyle would do this, due to the personal connection a maker has with their creations, but I would blacklist this Halo from ever being retuned. I'm sure that'd affect his resale price.

No it wouldn't. There are many eager buyers out there that are not so well-informed as to know about such things - so whoever brings that Halo in for retuning is bound to be just as much a victim, and has nothing to do with the scumbag flipper. I cannot see Kyle refuse that person a retune.

[Bikerbusk]

The way Jim, Kyle, & Aaron Run/Manage/Orchestrate the customer relations is an example how a company should be Run....
This douche bag's soul goal from the start was to Flip, and that is wasted breath if that was the case.. But the stance & examples that Pantheon does for all of us is inspiring I know for me and so many others here..and in that it makes us all try to do right thing...
This guy slipped threw & its personal to all... This site here not only educated me on pan, due to time spent in wait & watching all, So this guy is a right off nothing is going to change his mind, when it was set in the beginning in his head what he was going to do......

But there is a positive here for the others that see time and time again, here is the wording that busts my balls that don't understand......
...Due to Money Problems I Have to Sell My Pan ......

This is what the community can address to be a positive to person & in that , that will help control the fliping issues that everyone of the quality manufacturers deal with...

If money the problem let's help show how, in diffrent ways to do the do..

Example ... ( Pan gathering in N.C. is a great thing & love the guys for putting it on the time and all so don't take this as a slash against your venue because I want to come ...But looking at my funds # 1 goal is getting second pan different scale & in same motion a back up pan for worst case scenario that you can think of )

Please look up Busking conventions and gatherings .... You will find they are scattered all over the world....the same with Renaissance Fairs, and also Magic gatherings , etc, etc..

Just with that alone a pan gathering can be scheduled on the front end or back end to one of these type events, and even take in effect the price of hotels and make it 60 to a 100 miles away from one of these other functions .. buy doing this person is note gouged be hotel but in that also we have the record for mist staying in hotel room which was 14 adults ..... Never mind that

By scheduling pan gathering that you have the pan time, performance time , & socializing time ..
You can get a couple buskers workshop also in creating a tip and working a crowd, learn other skills to help enhance the over all that incorporates the use if pan...
The pan is a tool for the publuc... Yes its a form of enjoyment for all of us, but public enjoys also, so might as well get paid or work on skills to get paid for what we all love ...

I love saving steps and just to go to N.C. alone was going to be about 1k for that function...but say something like it at different parts of the world could be scheduled on a tuesday, Wednesday , Thursday go to like busking conventions or gathering on Friday , Saturday ,Sunday and look Wham...Bam.. KoBoom... You know have an even bigger venue for pans & street performing, and gaining skills in working public ...

Thats what we might start looking at for gathering at multiple locations around the world, and show and give confidence in performance skills ... We all lacking in something ,,and we all have skills that other members might appreciate and in that if you look at big picture that could help the fliping situation when individual has the tool and having money. Issues....


It's just a thought out loud... And hope it puts a seed in a head or two...But a rule I have learned is nothing wrong with bitching about a thing ... But to create a solution can turn a negative into a positive ....

But we found out a long time ago to piggyback a gathering on front end or back end if another venue is beneficial to our own gathering ....

And un that it might help membership in working public..so cash flow will help out ...Roy

[SteelQuest]

Just brutal, it is very infuriating seeing such behavior from both of these "flippers" I believe there must be a better way. It is a very unique position to be in, that once something is created and leaves the maker it is suddenly more valuable than before. This is a kudos to the "Big 4", and something that is a blessing to those who have, and a barrier to entry for those who do not. The people I feel the sorriest for is the makers in all this.

From everything I have seen all of the makers here have not adopted the stance of raising the bar of the price of their masterpieces to reflect this, which is a blessing for those of us waiting, however it is leaving a lot on the table in regards to $$ they could get. Again kudos to them for that.

I am not sure I totally agree with lino about the idea that the one who purchases these flipped halos (the examples before us) will not be concerned if he cannot get his (now very expensive) halo retuned/repaired should/when the need arrives. Anyone spending 5k plus on something that will need maintenance at some point will probably be referring to this forum, and if not will definitely be looking at the question part of ebay where it could be rightfully posted that this is being sold in full disregard of the ethos/wishes of the company, and is not eligible for retuning (perhaps we could get all the tuners on board for this??). Also if purchase of one of these "forbidden fruit" was to come with the penalty of a blacklist status with all the makers, this may be a way to also help in limiting the "gravy" on these sales. I know a blacklist section on the forum here sounds negative, but that may also be another possibility?

Personally I have also been waiting since 2010, but when the wait was finally too much I resisted the ebay route on principle, and found someone on the forum willing to part with theirs for the same price paid (although it was bought on auction previously so the price was higher than from the maker ).

I know there is no easy answer to this problem of snakes and flippers, but I feel very sorry for Kyle, Jim, and Aaron, who have done nothing but their best (and then some) to accommodate people and raise the level of their craft to new heights.

Thanks to the PS team for all their hard work, It is deeply appreciated by all (99.9% anyway) here, and may all the flippers get whats coming to them.

[Udu?Idu too]

I have to agree with lino. Whilst a 'tuning embargo' might dissuade those 'in the know', it's not safe to assume that all potential buyers are as savvy. I don't presume to speak for Kyle, but based on personal experience of him I doubt he'd refuse a retune out of love for the instrument as much as unwillingness to punish the buyer unecessarily (sp).