Hard Rock Hippie Drums

Warnings of suspect sales.

Re: Hard Rock Hippie Drums

Postby phoenix » Tue Dec 11, 2012 3:09 am

Darn, I have not seen Colin speaking out like this very often

That's some really long fingers pointing you way :giggle:

Have to admit though ... 'Hard Rock Hippie Drum' might not be the best name ...

How about 'Scary Hooded Guy Wok Gong' ?
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Re: Hard Rock Hippie Drums

Postby Spike » Tue Dec 11, 2012 4:09 am

Ut Oh, Now you pissed off Jesus Colin :giggle:

That be one homeless hoodie hippie dude I would not want mad at me... :shock:
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Re: Hard Rock Hippie Drums

Postby CarolW » Tue Dec 11, 2012 6:06 am

:mrgreen: Ummm; I think I see a fairly merciless call to order going on here! Of course, that's being achieved by pointing to realities where it's quite apparent certain realities have been missed :mrgreen:

I checked out some of the Wiki references Colin posted - interesting. Thanks for the links, Colin. From the 60s through early to mid-70s, I was moving around and studying as a mature student - I had about 10 years out of school (college) before I started those studies, and in the 7 years or so of continuing study and field research (guided by some excellent mentors), I learned a whole lot more - including about various possible distortions one can be put through in graduate school. MOST interesting, and VERY useful kind of knowledge.

During those years, I heard some references to some of the groups mentioned on Wiki, but since I wasn't studying popular music, I missed most, while I studied OTHER music.

Much of what I learned was, how to stay true to yourself and to others as well. I had wonderful examples of people doing that, and others of people NOT doing that. I saw respect and its absence, too.

I remember sitting on a panel, where I gave a short presentation pointing out some problems with lack of respect for people's art and capabilities. The room sat stunned during my presentation, and afterwards, one of my fellow students came up to me and said, "You are a very aggressive and unpleasant person."

So, the messenger got shot :mrgreen: :twisted: :evil: Talk about projection!

I remain unbelievably grateful for those years of study and research. I learned so VERY much that aids me now, many years down the road - that was some four decades ago.

And I made very, very dear friends in Spain, where I did my field studies. At the same time, I was exposed to the classical music of India, and of Java, and some from other countries; the ones I mentioned specifically grabbed me; I loved the music. So, Orhythm, now you know how and why I appreciate so much of your particular knowledge and playing.

And we, here at handpan.org, are blessed with Colin's truly great teaching. We have other very fine teachers too. Since Colin rather specializes in teaching, I think it's appropriate that he offers it to us in this thread.

In effect, he's saying, take time, probe deeply and widely, and don't make hasty judgments based on surface appearances, because if we do that, it leads us only to unwarranted assumptions (does this sound familiar?) such as Colin indicated have been made about him.

Mly sense of humor is greatly sparked, too, by the vision of Colin as a homeless, uneducated. not-very-capable - tramp! :lol: :lol: :lol:

The pitfalls of rushing and failing to put in solid study are many, indeed!

We do, though, have, on this forum, MASSES of REALLY good information on handpans.

And the posts on this forum, and the videos and soundtracks, serve as LEADS into the real world of music. Most forum members use these as they are able, and they live and act in the real world of music - and come back and report to the forum. THAT is a truly wonderful way both to learn and to teach.

The builders do the same - some in particular offer large amounts of help. Others just keep working and we see the results - Victor helps a lot; Luis builds and publishes examples - two wonderful ways to teach. And Kyle and Jim and Aaron offer all kinds of information at crucial moments in crucial ways.

How can we possibly be so FORTUNATE as to have this place - our unifying school, so to speak - provided by Gidda and others - aided by a magnificently competent and helpful team? - each of these, different people, with different backgrounds - but unified in the passion for music; specifically, handpan music. (Pardon me for including Hangs under "handpans" - that's really not kosher; my apologies to Felix and Sabina for doing that.)

Spike - I appreciate your irreverent humor. Irreverency can be a great aid to study, especially when we include ourselves as subjects for irreverence. :lol: :dd: :dance: :dd:

Mon, 10 Dec 2012 21:05:52 (PST)
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Re: Hard Rock Hippie Drums

Postby CarolW » Tue Dec 11, 2012 6:09 am

|My keyboard acted up as I wrote my last post; and I apologize to OMrhythm for the typo on his name - Rusty - I don't DARE edit that post till I shut down, turn my keyboard upside-down, and SHAKE it!

:mrgreen: Mon, 10 Dec 2012 21:09:42 (PST)
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Re: Hard Rock Hippie Drums

Postby omrhythm » Tue Dec 11, 2012 10:59 am

BKcustom wrote: These instruments need to be made more available to the public.It is our hope that one day there will not be waiting lists and $2000 dollar price tags.


Thanks for coming forward on our forum and introducing yourselves. I do think there is a lot of knowledge to glean here, both about making handpans, and about the culture itself that is formulating around these odd UFO-like vessels. I agree with said sentiments that perhaps you should actively participate in getting to know us, the handpan freakazoids, so that you understand not only who we are, but what we desire. I mean not to disclude you from that statement. You are one of us, as the circles of drum communion that separate us are merely a few degrees apart. But you have a lot to learn about the history of said vessels, and the history of culture that is evolving rapidly in front of us. As a psychologist, I can only hope that your passion will grow and merge with the threads of familiarity with which we share here.

All else aside, I must comment about this specific statement quoted above. Yes, we all agree I think that these instruments need to be made more available. But If you think that a good quality handpan should be less than $2000, then you are hoping for a world of handcans. Yes, $4000-10000 is perhaps an inflated price, when in a hypothetical future world the market readjusts itself with more instruments coming onto the scene. But to desire these to be less than $2000 is to ask for slave labor. It is like asking a surgeon to operate on you for $500.

Handpan makers deserve every penny of $2000-2500 for their efforts to make a HIGH QUALITY pan, particularly when more complex architecture and intricately designed intention is placed into these creations. Regardless of current market values, a master of steel tuning is a craft possessed by only a few dozen people world wide. That number of makers is growing, and there is a window in time that we are experience here and now, whereby the acceptable market value for lesser quality pans is quite susceptible to subjectivity, and wrought with what we call "the Milkers" of the market demand. This is a touchy subject, and a facet of the genre that is changing weekly, as newly inspired hammerers grow their efforts and ability in an exponential fashion. There is certainly an acceptable sound that warrants $800-1500 at the moment, IMO, but that sound is changing so rapidly that we must do our best to aid those willing to take the manufacturing journey in understanding where quality meets price. It is the most important topic in our genre for the next 3 years.

There is a great variance between what we, the elite and most senior members of handpanmania, and the general public, desire in regards to sound quality. Your husband's statements of his own personal choice and opinion of what is "quality" are a far cry from what most of us here desire. To that, I think some research and study is required on your and his behalf. The standards by which he considers "quality" are akin to getting surgery performed on oneself by a one handed inebriated monkey, IMHO.

While I encourage all aspiring makers to create these vessels, I, and many others I believe, will stand our ground firm when it comes to what is acceptable, what is exceptional, and to what passes as rubbish. The video that started this thread is neither exceptional, nor acceptable. It is a handcan garbage lid worthy of no more glorification than a rusty birdbath (HAH, the irony of self-slander). To see it as anything other is simply naive, and comes across to many as pure mockery of the passion that we share, or extreme ignorance, at best.

Welcome to the forum! :D

<3
Last edited by omrhythm on Tue Dec 11, 2012 11:25 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Hard Rock Hippie Drums

Postby omrhythm » Tue Dec 11, 2012 11:23 am

cfoulke wrote:Just because I wear my hair long and play music, it does not define me as a 'Hippie,' or anything else for that matter. I'd imagine that a large portion of society (a portion which you seem to be part of) might look at me when I busk and think I'm a hippie when in actuality I am well educated, employed, married, registered voter, volunteer, fundraiser...and just enjoy playing for others in public.
.

I gotta say, reading that Wiki page on Hippies really made me sad. It was written in past tense, like it was a dying art of consciousness. When I pull out many of the keywords and concepts of that article, I am fully aware that being a Hippie is alive and well in our culture and our world. It has evolved, and is not in fact dead. I truly believe that it is possible to be a well educated, employed, married, registered voter, volunteer, fund raiser, and still be a hippie. I in fact make a better living than 99% of "hippies," as implied by that article, but still completely resonate with the majority of the concepts which began such a movement. I think that while it does have a negative connotation in American society today, in reality, "Hippies" are still in fact some of the most inspiring people on the planet, capable of unplugging from mainstream paradigms and getting back to what is real and natural, rather than plastic and manipulated. The Song of the Forest is a welcome reminder of the vibrant culture that develops when one chooses to remove oneself from the hardness of "civilized" life, and get back to the essence of the Tao. Long live the Hippie, in its ever evolving manifestation of subversivity. The positive threads of consciousness that exist within that word and movement apply wholeheartedly to the essence of sub cultural that we birth through handpans, IMO....

And FWIW, I might add that, when applying a label to Colin, a sticker the size of Mount Fuji is required. :D
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Re: Hard Rock Hippie Drums

Postby don marco » Tue Dec 11, 2012 4:28 pm

for the record, I would love to hear handpan played in hippie music with so much noodling improve that you forget what song your listening to just as much as I would like to hear it played in classical arrangements, reggae, classical indian, gamelan, pop, country, folk, electronica, and definitely heavy metal, stoner metal and hard rock along with any other genre that someone feels inspired to try! Bring it on! :gimme:

I agree that it is important to know the culture that exists around this instrument, especially for anyone that wants to get into the business of selling them! I also believe that we, the people on this forum or any other, as well as the people playing these instruments world wide and the folks coming together for gatherings are in fact the people that are creating that culture. That culture is very young and barely developed however....much like this instrument. This thing is only 12 years old. Steel drums are only 75 years old. Think for a second about drumming cultures of the world, or the culture of classical string instruments as a comparison. 100s and 1000s of years old.

We must realize, like the inventors of this instrument, that this thing is too big for any one person or group of people to hold on to! As with numerous builders popping up every where, their is a culture popping up around them and around the people that obtain their instruments. There will always be a momentum of where we have been in these past 12 years, but there is an almost infinite horizon of possible directions for the future.

Will we follow the path of many religions with divided philosophies on minor details, each on our forum of choice? How much will we embrace new and novel ideas that are not in alignment with the momentum of our philosophy?

The answers don't really matter......as the truth is much bigger than any one person can conceive.

Either way, it's clear 2013 will be a year of separating the wheat from the chaff....especially ridiculously over priced chaff that some farmers try selling to a starving population.

:dd: :dd: :dd: :dd: :dd: :dd: :dd: :dd: :dd: :dd: <3 :dd: :dd: :dd: :dd: :dd: :dd: :dd: :dd:
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Re: Hard Rock Hippie Drums

Postby michael » Wed Dec 12, 2012 10:47 pm

so much hippies around here...
..-.and a new builder...
...a new member...
...a psychologiest...
...hard rock business man and woman...

but no admin???? :mrgreen: Has the party yet begun?

Questions:
1. Junglist, are you dealing further on with "Hard Rock Hippie Drums" without telling these are prototypes?
2. Hard Rock Hippie Drums, are you selling further on prototypes for crazy 1600 $?
3. BKcustom, are you thinking to spread "love" with bad sounding prototypes for crazy 1600 $?


okay back to flower power and colours and long hair and..... :dd:
:dd: :love: Hallo!
ich bin Michael

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Re: Hard Rock Hippie Drums

Postby Spike » Wed Dec 12, 2012 11:36 pm

1. Junglist, are you dealing further on with "Hard Rock Hippie Drums" without telling these are prototypes?


I think he already gave the reply to this:
It is not my desire to provide anyone with instruments for resale purposes nor am i affiliated with anyone trying to do so. All handpans made by me so far are prototypes and are clearly experimental workings.


The way it looks to me so far is they are doing a lot of things that the builders are not aware of.



Another fine example of this:
I am an exclusive dealer of Milltone drums

But when I asked Larry Miller about this, Larry said:
His claim of being an exclusive MILLTONE dealer (why would that even matter here?) is not correct



One to stay clear of me thinks..
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Re: Hard Rock Hippie Drums

Postby JeremyD » Thu Dec 13, 2012 12:30 am

A few hippy dippy drums on ebay too. Hmmmm.
2017 handpan comparison video
https://youtu.be/AuznuFfQG1I
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